Metro East Sun

City of Belleville City Council met Dec. 2

Here are the minutes provided by the council:

Mayor Gregory called this meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. 

City Clerk Gain Meyer called roll. Members present on roll call: Alderperson Whitaker, Alderperson Schneider, Alderperson Duco, Alderperson Eros, Alderperson Randle, Alderperson Anthony, Alderperson Ovian, Alderperson Dintelman, Alderperson Schaefer, Alderperson Stiehl, Alderperson Weygandt, Alderperson Sullivan, Alderperson Osthoff. 

Excused: Alderperson Ferguson, Alderperson Rothweiler, Alderperson Elmore 

ROLL CALL DEPARTMENT HEADS 

City Clerk Gain Meyer called roll of Department Heads: City Attorney, Garrett Hoerner; City Treasurer, Sarah Biermann; Police Chief, Matt Eiskant; Fire Chief, Stephanie Mills; Finance Director, Jamie Maitret; Director of Public Works, Jason Poole; Library Director, Leander Spearman; Director of IT, Ty Buckner; City Engineer, Scott Saeger; Director of Wastewater, Randy Smith; Director of Health, Housing & Building, Scott Tyler; Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning, Clifford Cross; Director of Maintenance, Mike Schaefer. 

Excused: Director of Human Resources, William Clay 

PLEDGE 

PUBLIC HEARING

None

PUBLIC PARTICIPATION 

Michael Hagberg: 701 Centreville Avenue. Tonight, I want to talk about electric aggregation. I received a notice that the City wanted to change my supplier to someone charging a hiring rate than my choice of suppliers. Over the last couple of years, I have saved hundreds of dollars by making my decision and choice of which supplier to use. I was forced to mail a postcard back providing my personal information, name, address, account number, and signature. To a company that I had no intention of doing business with. Less I remind you of the number of computer database breaches that have made national news. Even after having the postcard, I still received notice from Ameren that another was attempting to change my supplier, I then had to call that company, deal with their voicemail system, finally connecting to a call center and demand that they stop trying to steal my electric supply. How convenient for them to claim that the postcard got lost in the mail. My aggravation was first set up by the city, the Council added one sentence stating that if Ameren rate was lower than the aggregator, the aggregator must meet that price or switch everyone back to Ameren. Please add that sentence and clause back into all future contracts. 

Richard Summitt: I am here today to speak about a Zoning Ordinance Violation at The Nunnery, also known as 1024 North Douglas Avenue, owned by Gabriel Kimme. I have been close friends with Gabriel for several years and during that time, I have become heavily involved in the events (inaudible). 

(Inaudible) hosted but for the last few years we have had some events that were larger than expected leading to issues with noise and parking, but I want to be clear, those events are no longer happening, they have not for over a year, we have no intention of hosting any of that nature again. Many of the complaints were brought up at last week's Zoning Board of Appeals meeting and I can say here tonight and yes, we did have an outdoor chill a few months ago where things got a bit too loud but, in every instance, that we were aware that there with issues with sound and parking Gabriel and myself and our community jumped into action to resolve them immediately. You know, he has been compliant with the Belleville Police even when they came on the property without Gabriel's consent. Gabriel and Jackie have also maintained a respectful dialogue with the neighbor (inaudible) who has a personal vendetta against us. We acted with professionalism, respect, and (inaudible) counterculture for individuals in this town, these people live here whether the city government likes it or not and they deserve a place where they can express themselves freely and safely just like anyone else in Belleville. Let me be absolutely clear, we are kind people, we are respectful people, our priority is safety and comfort in the space that Gabriel has generously shared with us. It is meant to be a welcoming, safe place for all. Contrary to the misinformation that has been circulating, both in the community and with some of the city government, our events are private. The article in the paper was not an open invitation to the public, it was simply highlighting something positive happening in Belleville. Nobody gets into our events without an invitation, if a friend brings someone, we vet them, and they are no longer a stranger by the time they leave. Now, there are three points I want you to address, three points I feel are essential to communicate. One, we have no interest in event space, we don't want to turn our events into commercial events for profit that has never been our intention and never will be. Two, we take the safety of our gatherings seriously. Yes, people bring alcohol, but we would never allow any underage drinking. I am a stepfather and have two children ages nine and twelve with another one on the way, and I care deeply about keeping the children safe and we ensure that the trust and safety of everyone, especially young people, is never violated. Three, the Zoning Board of Appeals meeting did not prove that we are operating an illegal venue. The Zoning Department, including Cliff, did not provide any concrete evidence beyond the newspaper article. The concerns raised at the last meeting about parking, noise, and (inaudible) or applying food safety codes to a private residence are simply unfounded. The idea that private residences can't serve as safe spaces for people who need them is frankly misguided. These are spaces where people gather to share experiences not where the City should close in on reasonable and irrelevant regulations.

Hannah Buschman: 1017 Bristow Street. I will also be speaking on the, I think there may have been a misunderstanding when it comes to what The Nunnery is. The Nunnery is not a venue nor is that the aim. It is Mr. Kimme's private residence that he lives in personally. He has lived there for seven and a half years and will be eight years next summer. After talking to him and his good friend Mr. Summitt and learning how The Nunnery came to be. Gabe is a musician and has musician friends. The Nunnery started out as a few musician friends getting together for a jam session (inaudible) today. No one, not even Gabe, could have ever imagined how much The Nunnery would have grown. Over the last seven and a half years, Gabe has helped fill community for local musicians and created the like to come and share their God given gifts. Communities like this are crucial for young or new talents to emerge. Even if (inaudible) playing at someone's house party to gain confidence to play bigger crowds. For all we know, the next Johnny Cash could walk through The Nunnery's doors. When we say it is a safe space, what we mean is that no one is turned away for how they look or what kind of past may be following them. This is extremely important for people like me, I have never fit in anywhere and I have never truly felt safe around other people, I have never once felt safe or accepted at a church. I was baptized Catholic and attended private Catholic school for years and was never accepted or shown kindness, all I have ever known was rejection and isolation for those people. I have also been in therapy for years and can honestly say that the folks at The Nunnery have contributed more to my personal growth and development than any behavioral health professional ever has. What I always needed was unconditional love and acceptance and I found it there at The Nunnery. If I don't feel safe at home or if I need support, I know I can show up to The Nunnery and receive it. But this isn't just about me, it is about Gabe and the positive impact his presence has in the community. He helps cultivate family and friendships just by opening his home every once in a while, throwing parties or hosting a little get-together. He should not be punished for this; threatening fines and court rulings is cruel and unnecessary. I ask that you show some grace and compassion towards him when you make your final decision tonight. 

Bethany Lumos: 1031 South Charles Street. My relationship with The Nunnery, though I am a musician, and I am friends with a lot of musicians, has been completely based out of the community there. There is a lot of harm reduction programs that we do and that I am heavily involved with, and I think they are super important that having a space where if something is going awry you can be there and just exists that is so special and crucial for existence in our world. The convent's intended purpose is to bring people together. Jesus' mission was love and the convent is being used exactly for that intended purpose. It is a space where people are put first, and love is happening. And music is a part of people, it just so happens. I plead that you go no further against Gabe and he is a great person and is contributing in really positive ways in this town and he is an asset to Belleville. 

Macie Jay Winter: Two Primrose Drive Swansea. I am here to also speak about the Nunnery at Gabe's house. I just want to speak of historic precedence, I am sure a lot of you have heard of the Titanic, they called it Titanic it was simply a cruise ship owned by the British White Star Line whose parent company was owned by J.P. Morgan. How many of you have heard of Zeus? It is a yacht owned by Elon Musk. How about Nabila, it is a yacht owned by Donald Trump, how about the Castle, the Secret Service code name for the White House, it is owned by the American people. Concerts have historically happened at the White House over time, Willy Nelson performed for Jimmy Carter in 1980, Aretha Franklin and (inaudible) performed for Barack Obama in 2016, Johnny Cash performed in 1970 for Richard Nixon. My point is that all these are just names for names, yacht for Zeus as to a house is The Nunnery. It is just a name, it is Gabe's house, he welcomed us in there and he has gave us all a safe place to be and ourself in whatever art form we want. I have admittedly only been to Gabe's house once but the one time I had been there I found a safe place. I too was baptized in the Catholic house, and I have felt more safe, in a Catholic Church excuse me, and I have felt more safe in Gabe's house than I did in the Catholic Church I grew up in. I guess that is the point I want to make.

Natalie Schmersahl: 7 Rusty Wil Drive. I have been going to Gabe's house for a while to enjoy all the stuff there. I got to say I was here for last hearing and everybody it seemed like the entire room was confused with what was going on here, like they seemed like they were accusing The Nunnery of being a venue when it was just Gabe's house a place for all of his friends to hang out and play music together and dance whatever and it literally made no sense, like at the very end of it they were all like oh policy you are voting for policy you are not voting for what we are saying and at no point did anyone prove that The Nunnery was in fact a venue. There has been no definition like written anywhere in the books, legally in this County or this town of what a venue is. It was very, very strange, it seemed like they were just like it seems like it would be a waste of resources if it goes to like court or something because there is no evidence that it is a venue, it is just a house where people are playing together, it would be a waste of City resources and time to just, please take that into consideration when you make your decision tonight. 

PRESENTATIONS, RECOGNITIONS & APPOINTMENTS 

Mayor Gregory recognized the character word of the month "EMPATHY" identifying and understanding other's feelings in order to get along better. 

Human Relations Commission Introduction 

APPROVAL OF MINUTES 

Alderperson Schaefer made a motion second by Alderperson Stiehl to approve the City Council Meeting and Executive Session Minutes of November 18, 2024 

All members voted aye. 

Motion carries. 

CLAIMS, PAYROLL AND DISBURSEMENTS 

Alderperson Whitaker made a motion second by Alderperson Weygandt to approve claims and disbursements in the amount of $3,100,848.77 and payroll in the amount of $970,948.51. 

Members voting aye on roll call: Whitaker, Schneider, Duco, Eros, Randle, Anthony, Ovian, Dintelman, Schaefer, Stiehl, Weygandt, Sullivan, Osthoff. (13) 

Motion carries. 

REPORTS 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Stiehl to approve the Treasurer's Report- October 2024 and Statement of Cash and Investments Report - October 2024. 

All members voted aye. 

Motion Carries. 

ORAL REPORTS FROM STANDING COMMITTEES, SPECIAL COMMITTEES AND ANY OTHER ORAL REPORTS FROM THE ELECTED OFFICIALS OR STAFF 

STREETS & GRADES 

Alderperson Randle made a motion second by Alderperson Eros to approve the following motions: 

Motion to approve a proposal with Helitech in the amount of $30,526.00 to improve the retaining wall behind 116 South Charles Street (ARPA Funds) 

Motion to enter into an agreement with Oates Associates in the amount of $9,900.00 for Professional Engineering Services for various improvements of alleyways located in TIF 12 (TIF 12 Funds) 

Motion to enter into an agreement with Lochmueller Group in the amount of $8,000.00 for an STP Grant Application (General Funds) 

Motion to sell/scrap 2006 Dodge Grand Caravan (VIN # 2D4GP44L56R898909) (Parks Department) 

Motion to approve the ADA Transition Plan from Oates Associates 

Members voting aye on roll call: Schneider, Duco, Eros, Randle, Anthony, Ovian, Dintelman, Schaefer, Stiehl, Weygandt, Sullivan, Osthoff, Whitaker. (13) 

Motion carries. 

ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS 

56-NOV24-DO MORE GOOD COFFEE & CRAFT, LLC: Request for a Map Amendment to rezone the property commonly known as 7011 West Main Street (07-01.0-417-033) from "B-1" Multi-Family Residence District to "C-2" Heavy Commercial District (Applicable section of the Zoning Code: 162.590) Ward 4. Zoning Board of Appeals recommended APPROVAL with a vote of 4-0. 

58-NOV24 – FCB BANKS F/K/A FIRST COUNTY BANK: Request for a Map Amendment to rezone the property commonly known as 4815 West Washington Street (08-07.0-421-047) from "C-2" Heavy Commercial District to “A-1” Single-Family Residence District (Applicable section of the Zoning Code: 162.590) Ward 8. Zoning Board of Appeals recommended APPROVAL with a vote of 4-0. 

60-NOV24 – CITY OF BELLEVILLE ZONING CODE AMENDMENT: Request for amendment of Title XV (Land Usage) of the Revised Ordinances of the City of Belleville, Illinois, Section 162.503 “SCHEDULE OF FEES”. Zoning Board of Appeals recommended APPROVAL with a vote of 4-0. 

Alderperson Schaefer made a motion second by Alderperson Eros to approve the requests as presented. 

All members voted aye. 

Motion carries. 

59-NOV24 – GABRIEL KIMME: Formal appeal of the Zoning Administrator interpretation of the Zoning Code determining that the utilization of the property commonly known as 1024 North Douglas Avenue (08-22.0-101-041) as a "Concert Hall/Event Venue" is not a permitted use in accordance with the provisions of Section 162.168 (Permitted Uses). (Applicable sections of the Zoning Code: 162.168, 162.550, 162.551, 162.552, 162.553, 162.554, 162.555) Ward 1. Zoning Board of Appeals recommended DENIAL with a vote of 4-0 

Alderperson Whitaker made a motion second by Alderperson Schneider to approve the denial as recommended by the Zoning Board of Appeals 

Alderperson Whitaker: I understand all of the comments that were made at Zoning and the comments that were made here tonight and I appreciate the fact that the group has come together and found a place that works for them, however, we have to consider as a Council is based on the activities described would we approve that activity in every home that is zoned identical to this property which is currently zoned as A2. We have a Special Use Permit process, and I believe that is the most appropriate way to carry this out. If they wanted to utilize their property for something like that to request a Special Event permit for that night. That is why I would encourage a denial for this as a permitted use. 

Alderperson Eros: Is there money being taken because there would have to be a ticket price if it is a venue? So, if there is no ticket price, if there is no money exchanging hands for what is going on then I guess I don't understand why it needs to be a Special Use Permit. He happens to have a large property and can accommodate a large amount of people, not to say that there haven't been issues in the past but they are in the past. I don't see how it is any different than handling a call of disturbance from a neighbor. I am just confused as to the clarification for the Concert Hall/Event Venue. Is there a checklist that they are adhering to be considered that, do they check all those boxes? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Well, so, let's be clear, nobody indicated the bad people or anything like that. What the process is, I think is what we are really talking about here, right? We are not really asking for permission for them to do it tonight. The process is, if there was enough evidence, in our opinion, that it violated the Zoning Code in permitted uses section of that code. We send a violation letter, they then have the right to appeal the decision of the Zoning Administrator, me. That goes to the Zoning Board of Appeals. You have the Public Hearing; they make their recommendation to the Mayor and Council. So, they are recommending to you that they feel we are accurately addressing this issue based on that non-permitted use. The final Municipal look at this, so to speak, is to come to Council, right? So, if you uphold the decision of the Zoning Board of Appeals, you are basically saying we made that interpretation, we followed the administrative process that we are required to follow. Now, I heard them say tonight, we're not doing it anymore, it is the end of story, right? We don't pursue it with the Circuit Court at that point. If they are, if they really have ended it, then it is no longer a problem, but they had the opportunity to come to you tonight to file this appeal and be heard at the City Council level. Now, in terms of the collection of money, that doesn't necessarily make it a put it in a classification where it can't be done there. It is a non-permitted use, either way you look at it, either as a non-traditional accessory use to the primary use of the single family residence, or if they are using it a majority of the time as a concert hall or event venue, nobody is disputing whether they live there and they have the right to have a private party but, the evidence that we have seen shows that it leans towards a non-traditional accessory use and therefore is not a permitted use in that underlining zoning district. Ultimately what happens if they continue then we have to discuss with our legal do we pursue this through St. Clair County and then the judge will make the call at that point. 

Alderperson Eros: Okay, so now my next question for you Cliff, since I wasn't at the ZBA meeting, so sorry if this has already been talked about but, the evidence that was presented, was it people's opinions, hearsay, or was it really solid- 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: So, we touched on this starting over a year ago, we got some initial complaints and concerns. The applicant came into my office with my staff and I and we advised very similarly to what I just said that we are not here to stop you from having a private party, right, everybody can have Thanksgiving dinner at the house, right? But it cannot turn into a non-traditional accessory use. We hadn't heard much about it, then we got some complaints that came down the line, then all of the sudden this article comes out and it is talking about these bands and everything else and tended to look like it is an Event Venue or a concert hall or a non-traditional accessory use to a permitted use. That is what we had to go on, that was the whole purpose of coming before the Zoning Board of Appeals because I am not going to say that I am always right, I am not going to say that I am always wrong, right? I, just as Zoning Administrator, we have to take the evidence that we have and make our best call because our responsibility is to not only not doing an illegal taking on their property but, we have to prevent an illegal taking of the neighbor's properties whose traditional neighborhood lifestyle has been impacted by the use. 

Alderperson Eros: Is that still, I mean the first gentleman who spoke in Public Participation made it sound like that part of the issues have been resolved. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: This is really how it is going to go, you know depending upon what happens, if you overturn and say that their appeal is legitimate, then they continue to do what they are doing, right? If you uphold the recommendation of the ZBA and the staff, then we really go into a wait and see mode and see if they continue or if they stop, right? Now, I can assure you this, and I am going to say this for the record, I am not going to be watching them like a hawk and every 

time they have a New Year's Eve party, you know what I am saying but, when you traditionally host parties are not big articles in the paper talking about these events and things like that, let's just be honest. Now they can talk about the article may not be accurate, all I know is the article was there, and it was on top of what we already talked about. 

Alderperson Schneider: One person spoke on it is a safe place, well a safe place is a place where you go talk things over that is not where you go to a private home to do that, a safe place is like where you drop a baby off at the Firehouse or something and there are so many people and at the first meeting one said well we will have twenty and one was up to one hundred then it was two hundred, no we only have forty. The amount of people changed all of the time and one said he preferred to have his music as a concert place, is what was just said. So, and the one at the meeting before had suggested he was allowed to stay there because he drank too much. Who is overseeing this when they do get to drinking and when someone younger that twenty-one does come in, you don't have to pay to make it, you go to a family gathering, you have to chip in money so you can't have a family gathering, they are chipping in money for food and that. There is one bathroom for all these people and that is my concern. That is not a family get together or birthday party or an anniversary. 

Alderperson Sullivan: Can you elaborate on this non-traditional accessory use? What exactly was the violation to begin with? What are we voting on appealing or not appealing tonight? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: The fact that they are hosting events there, whether compensated or --- 

Alderperson Sullivan: It doesn't sound like they are hosting events they are just having people over at their home. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: But we've got, we had the article, we have had people who have made complaints that they see that they are full at their events, you have people talking about it. Look, we may take this to court, and the judge may say you are wrong and you can't do this but, there are certain elements there that we also have to look at, we have to look after the life safety issues, to the point about code issues, the gentleman brought it up, they are setting up stages, they are setting up music equipment, they are having bands there and you all know what happens when you have improper uses of that. You have stages that collapse on people, you have fires, you might not have appropriate ingress and egress, we are not here to stop them from having their occasional get togethers but, there was a enough to the story and the elements and our prior discussion and there was talk about people staying there and other elements, I heard tonight you know, there is a convent there, I mean are you operating as a church. 

Alderperson Sullivan: I have set up bounce houses for my child's birthday, would that mean I would be in violation having set up equipment in my yard? Because of this, I am not understanding why with them having a stage is in violation. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: It is just all of the elements of a non- traditional accessory use. That is in our opinion. Now if you feel that is not accurate, then you don't uphold the appeal. But until we have to go through this process to move forward if it continues. Like I said, the best thing would be if they stop, if they stop, they stop, it is best for everybody. 

Alderperson Weygandt: How many people at one time have been there? Estimate. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: I can only go by what I heard in the testimony, I have heard them say twenty, I thought I heard them say well over fifty but, we heard tonight that sometimes people show up with friends. That was a direct question that was asked, and I don't know if there was ever an exact number, I think the number was an average. 

Alderperson Weygandt: How many complaints were there from the neighbors? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: I know there has been at least two or three with the Police and then I know there were some neighbors that came during the Public Hearing that expressed their concerns about parking on their property and parking in private businesses and things like that. 

Alderperson Weygandt: How many times have the Police been called there? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: I cannot give you that exact number. 

Police Chief Eiskant: I cannot give you the exact number, but we have been called out there. 

Alderperson Weygandt: Were there any fights? Or underage drinking? 

Police Chief Eiskant: I will have to reread the report. 

Alderperson Weygandt: Most of the concerns were from the neighbors? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: The concerns from the neighbors were parking on private property, parking on some commercial businesses, coming across their property. Honestly, I didn't hear a lot about noise but what we did hear during testimony was the encroachment upon private property. 

Alderperson Weygandt: And what time do these things get over? One, two, three, four? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Eleven, twelve something like that I would suspect. 

Alderperson Schaefer: This is zoned Single Family housing, correct? 

Multiple people saying yest. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Well, it is actually A2. 

Multiple people talking. 

Alderperson Sullivan: In my family, we have a lot of gatherings, we have anywhere from thirty to sixty people show up to my private residence on a regular basis, this doesn't seem like a non-conforming use in my opinion. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Non-conforming use is a grandfathered use, it is a non-traditional accessory. 

Alderperson Sullivan: It just sounds like friends gathering together and having a good time. If there are noise violations, if there are parking issues, I don't think the City should be a part of making those decisions or punishing them for that, I think the City saying no to something like this on private property is incredibly wrong. They should be allowed to gather on their own private property. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Understood. 

Alderperson Stiehl: I feel like if the Zoning Board denied it 4-0, that is why we have a Zoning Board, they must have had some reason. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: What they do is, so their role in this is to hear the testimony, sworn testimony, then they issue the advisory report. In that advisory report, you traditionally have what we call your findings of fact. They felt like there was enough leaning towards what is not a traditional type of permitted use to uphold the determination to what they felt was not enough. 

Alderperson Stiehl: Could they go, could the owner of this house go and do some other type of zoning? For this event? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: The short answer is yes but, you get a whole other set of issues if you are rezoning properties. Say you rezone it to a C2, underlining zoning district that allows for commercial uses, you could have a lot more negative impact on the abutting residential properties, because more intense uses are allowed. 

Alderperson Stiehl: That was my other question, to the Ward 1 Alderpersons, you have had complaints from the neighbors? Parking and noise? 

Alderperson Whitaker: This initially started, as the Director mentioned, well over a year ago with events that were advertised via social media. There were flyers out for them, those initial events had hundreds of cars that filled the Dill's parking lot, the church, and the old YMCA. Every event is not to that magnitude but, there were several that reached that level, those were the events where the Police were called etc., this was then turned into Zoning to review. The argument is not for them to have friends over and play music and do their thing, it is when, there was an admission at the Zoning Hearing that they elected to do one of them as an outdoor party and they, by their own admission, admitted it got extremely loud and they page 9 of 16 

received complaints and the Police showed up. There was one admission at the Zoning Hearing that they had one party that had over two hundred guests, in a private residence. There were various things that led to confirming the complaints that we have received. We want them to be able to have private gatherings at their house but, what we have to consider is, are we allowing that in every home with the same Zoning. It is the opinion of the Ward that we cannot do that.

Alderperson Eros: I just think it is opening a can of worms that we do not want to open, I mean, with Nora in that we have a very, very large family and we are very rowdy when we get together and we have outdoor a whole lot because we have a beautiful yard and we have people parking all over the street. Carmen knows she lives down the street from me. So sometimes we have had a parking issue with Gundlach's, which is a business that abuts our property and when that is an issue, we are contacted by Gundlach, and we have talked to them since we have had issues, and we have taken care of those issues. I think it is dangerous to say what people can do and cannot do on their private property. If there is a complaint, then there is a complaint, deal with the complaint. If the Police are called in, break up the party do whatever it is. We have had, I have lodged complaints over the years with our neighbors who will have very loud music playing outside, not two hundred people but, loud music playing outside until late. So, I call the Police, and they do that. They deal with the issue as the issue arises, it is not that we need to step in and control what people are doing but, yeah, I mean if they step out of line and the Police are called to break it up, break it up. If they are parking in the wrong thing, tow their car, put a fine on their car, that is okay, I get that but, as a City do I want to tell somebody what they can do in their private property, no. Then the evidence that we got are people who are not happy and disgruntled neighbors and sometimes those views can be colored by anger or frustration and so comments can come across that aren't maybe one hundred percent true. Just like we cannot take what the Belleville News Democrat said in the article for gospel, I mean it is an article, and somebody complained, and they complained and say this is happening but there is no firm evidence of any of it. It is all talk, so that to me is just a little, it sounds a little dangerous to me. 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Look, I don't disagree with you, you have heard me say all the time, we cannot have an illegal taking. What I am saying is, Zoning Codes are evolving codes, right? They are never perfect, you can't possibly think of every use, because the moment you do, somebody jumps ahead of you. That is why you have verbiages in your Zoning Codes when it is a non-defined use that is expressly prohibited. We could have looked at it that way. The point I am making is, when we receive these, we don't address that actual property maintenance, we don't address illegal tow, all we can do is best interpret the Zoning Code as written, right? We set a precedence. Now, bear in mind, to Alderperson Whitaker's point, when you make a decision for Zoning, you don't make a decision for one piece of property, you make a decision, in a sense, an amendment to that underlining Zoning District, and this could potentially happen at all single-family residences. My job and my responsibility is when we hear those non-traditional things, that is why we have this appeal process, I am not saying I am all mighty, what I am saying is, we are obligated to address it because it is not, in our opinion, based on what we are seeing, it is not a permitted traditional accessory. 

Alderperson Eros: To your point there, four people who said it wasn't and so four people out of an entire city. 

Alderperson Schneider: If we can't tell people what to do with their property, why do we have a Zoning Board? The Zoning Board is to look out for everybody in the city, not just the ones that are there. The Zoning Board is doing their job, it is not like they are having, you're saying you can't have birthday parties and that, but this is all the time. When you have this many people and one says it is a safe space, so what page does that mean, it's a safe space? It is a safe space where they can go and stay that is not a private property, a safe space, that is a business or a, that is why it needs to go back to Zoning if they don't like, and then they admitted they have concerts, they referred it to concerts. You have how many people at all different times, one at the last meeting said he was invited to the meeting, so he invited some people that were not, the owner doesn't really know who really is invited. As far as the one being so drunk that he had to stay overnight, where is the alcohol coming in? How do they check the ids? How do they know who is twenty- one or not? If you have a personal property party, you are responsible for that person, if they leave and have an accident or if someone under twenty-one gets too much alcohol, they shouldn't have any alcohol. 

Alderperson Whitaker: Mayor, I just want to bring one last point up as we bring this to a vote here. We talk about the personal uses of the property and that is not what this was, I am going to make reference to one of the flyers that was published for an event there, it was on August 24th of this year, and it was titled Decimation of Belleville at The Nunnery, August 24th $10, BYOB, doors open at 6:00 p.m. and it listed six different businesses that same night. It was checked and there were several cars illegally using private parking lots, that was just an example of what has been happening there. This is not having family over and putting a bounce house up, this is a different use, and it is something that has to be regulated. If this type of thing is not going to happen at the property anymore, as they said during Public Comment, it is going to be a moot point but, the Zoning Administrator made a decision, they appealed that decision and went to the Zoning Board, they made a ruling we have to make a decision as a Council tonight if this type of activity is permitted in an A2 District. That is what we are here to decide on tonight, if they are going to have private people inside that house and have parties, that is allowed, this is not. This is what the Zoning Administrator made their decisions based off of. 

Alderperson Schaefer: That is what I was going to say, I think the whole thing comes down to when you send a flyer out like that and you have a cover charge, you are acting as though you are a business. If that is true, you are promoting it as a business. 

Alderperson Weygandt: I agree with you, I would not want that in my neighborhood either, if they are going to have people coming from everywhere and charging them $10. No, I am not for this, it is just asking for trouble, problems, and I don't agree with it. 

Alderperson Sullivan: When the flyer was brought up, the entire group laughed, may I ask why? Can somebody explain that to me? 

Female Unknown person: Because that was privately put on Facebook, that wasn't even a - - - 

Male Unknown person: It was a friend's birthday party, who is in a band in Belleville. 

2nd Male Unknown person: They didn't make the flyer, someone else did. 

Multiple people talking. 

Mayor Gregory: I do want to clarify something for you. Parking and noise are a city's concern. When bars are playing their music too loud, when people are parking on other people's parking lots or in their garage, in their drive-ways or in their front yards, to say that parking and noise is not a City issue that we should be involved in, it really is a City issue. 

Alderperson Sullivan: I agree, which is why we had noise ordinances and parking ordinances but I don't think they should be 

Multiple people talking. 

Mayor Gregory: It didn't kind of come across that way. 

Alderperson Randle: If I understand this correctly, Cliff, they have not applied for an Event Center, correct? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Correct, no. Nor would they be eligible to apply with the underlining zoning. 

Mayor Gregory: And there is no commercial certificate of occupancy permit. Am I correct? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: Correct, it is a residential occupancy permit when you look at residential occupancy permits you have other provisions in that that require certain occupancy loads based on the number of bedrooms, the square footage of bedrooms, number of unrelated occupants that can reside there. That is why sometimes you will see a dorm or something like that, but no, you are correct, there is no commercial occupancy permit. 

Alderperson Sullivan: Can I just get clarification of what exactly we are voting for? 

City Clerk Gain Meyer: So, the motion and the second on the floor is to deny their appeal. 

Alderperson Sullivan: What does that mean? What are the consequences? 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: So, what that means at this point is that his appeal of the determination of Zoning Administrator and the recommendation of the Zoning Board of Appeals is upheld. Now, if there are no more elements associated with the event center, it is done. But, if they continue, then we move forward with working with legal to address it through the court. We have to address it as a civil matter from a Zoning standpoint, because they still have private property rights, we may address this and take it across the street, now the judge may say you all are crazy, they can do what they want and they are not, it would be end of story. Our goal is to continue to best enforce this code. That was the recommendation of the Zoning Board, that they felt like we were more on the side of correctly interpreting this as a non-traditional accessory event, concert venue. 

Alderperson Schaefer: So, they can still gather if they choose to, it is just don't send the flyers out and don't have - - 

Director of Economic Development, Planning & Zoning Cross: That is my point, we didn't address this until we had the most recent article come out and we are not addressing parking violations, we only can address this from a Zoning standpoint, which is what we are doing based on the evidence we had. 

Mayor Gregory: Jenny, will you reread the motion? 

City Clerk Gain Meyer: 59-NOV24 – GABRIEL KIMME: Formal appeal of the Zoning Administrator interpretation of the Zoning Code determining that the utilization of the property commonly known as 1024 North Douglas Avenue (08-22.0-101-041) as a “Concert Hall/Event Venue” is not a permitted use in accordance with the provisions of Section 162.168 (Permitted Uses). (Applicable sections of the Zoning Code: 162.168, 162.550, 162.551, 162.552, 162.553, 162.554, 162.555) Ward 1. Zoning Board of Appeals recommended DENIAL with a vote of 4-0. 

Alderperson Sullivan: So, if we vote no, that means - - 

City Clerk Gain Meyer: Yes, would mean you are upholding the denial of their appeal. 

Multiple people talking. 

Members voting aye on roll call: Duco, Randle, Anthony, Ovian, Dintelman, Schaefer, Stiehl, Weygandt, Osthoff, Whitaker, Schneider (11) 

Members voting nay on roll call: Eros, Sullivan (2) 

Motion to deny carries. 

COMMUNICATIONS 

BIERSTACHELN FESTIVAL – 02/01/2025 

Request from Shoehorn Brewing to host the Bierstacheln Festival, Saturday, February 1, 2025, 12:00pm to 10:00pm. Street closure request: use of Paderborn Square and 2 parking spots on west side of North Church before alley (not to include ADA parking) for food trucks. Additional City services: picnic tables, cones and approval for fire pits following Fire Department guidelines. 

ST PATRICK'S DAY PARADE - 03/15/2025 

Request from the Ancient Order of Hibernians to host the St. Patrick's Day Parade, Saturday, March 15, 2025, 11:00am to 1:00pm. Street closure request: parade line-up North 3rd Street from West "A" Street to West "C" Street, 10:00am to 1:30pm. Parade rolling route closure 3rd Street to West Main east to Oak Street. Additional City services: trash toters, barricades, "No Parking" signage, clean-up, and personnel 

HONORING THE LEGACY MEMORIAL DAY 5K - 05/26/2025 

Request from Trail Life Troop IL-0078 to host their Legacy Memorial Day 5K, Monday, May 26, 2025, 8:45am to 9:45am. Street closure request: rolling closure along 5K route and close one lane on West Main Street between 2nd and 4th Streets, 8:30am to 10:00am. Additional services requested: barricades, trash toters, water and Police Personnel 

MEMORIAL DAY PARADE - 05/26/2025 

Request from City of Belleville to hold the Belleville Memorial Day Parade, Monday, May 26, 2025, 10:00am to 11:00am. Street closure request: North 3rd Street from West "A" Street to Hough Park, 9:00am to 11:00am. Parade route rolling closure, 10:00am to 11:00am. Additional City services: barricades, "No Parking" signage, Port-a-Potties, clean-up, Police and Public Works personnel 

BELLEVILLE SHRINERS PARADE - 06/06/2025 

Ainad Shriners request to hold the Belleville Shriners Parade, Friday, June 6, 2025, 7:30pm to 11:00pm. Street closure request: staging areas 5:30pm to 9:30pm; North 3rd Street between West "A" Street (north side) to West "F" Street (south side); West "C" Street from North 2nd Street to North 4th Street Rear; 7:30p.m. rolling closure along parade route. Additional City services: Police and Public Works Personnel, "No Parking" signage, barricades, trash toters, electrical panels and clean-up of parade route. Banner across North Illinois Street. 

ST. TERESA PARISH PICNIC – 08/23/2025 

Request from St. Teresa Catholic Church to host their Parish Picnic, Saturday, August 23, 2025, 4:00pm to 11:00pm. No street closures. Additional City services: picnic tables and trash toters 

ST. AUGUSTINE PARISH PICNIC – 09/27/2025 

Request from St. Augustine of Canterbury Church to host their Parish Picnic, Saturday, September 27, 2025, 12:00pm to 11:00pm. Additional request: picnic tables and trash toters. 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Duco to approve the Communications. 

All members voted aye. 

Motion carries. 

PETITIONS

None

RESOLUTIONS 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Schneider to read Resolutions 3527, 3528, 3529 and 3530 by title only and as a group. 

All members present voted aye. 

Motion carries. 

RESOLUTION 3527 

A Resolution of Support and Commitment of RBI Funds for Downtown Resurfacing 

RESOLUTION 3528 

A Resolution Requesting Permission from IDOT to Close Route 159 for the St. Patrick's Day Parade - Saturday, March 15, 2025 

RESOLUTION 3529 

A Resolution Requesting Permission from IDOT to Close Route 159 for the Memorial Day Parade Monday, May 26, 2025 

RESOLUTION 3530 

A Resolution requesting permission from IDOT to close Route 159 for Shriners' Parade Friday, June 6, 2025 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Schaefer to approve Resolutions 3527, 3528, 3529 and 3530 as read. 

Members voting aye on roll call: Eros, Randle, Anthony, Ovian, Dintelman, Schaefer, Stiehl, Weygandt, Sullivan, Osthoff, Whitaker, Schneider, Duco, (13) 

Motion carries. 

ORDINANCES 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Schaefer to read Ordinances 9348, 9349, 9350, 9351, and 9352 by title only and as a group. 

All members present voted aye. 

Motion carries. 

ORDINANCE 9348-2024 

An Ordinance Authorizing Sale/Conversion of Personal Property (2006 Dodge Grand Caravan -- Parks Department) 

ORDINANCE 9349-2024 

A ZONING ORDINANCE IN RE CASE #56-NOV24-Do More Good Coffee & Craft, LLC 

ORDINANCE 9350-2024 

A ZONING ORDINANCE IN RE CASE #58-NOV24-FCB Banks F/K/A First County Bank 

ORDINANCE 9351-2024 

A ZONING ORDINANCE IN RE CASE #60-NOV24-City of Belleville Zoning Code Amendment 

ORDINANCE 9352-2024 

An Ordinance Approving Amendment to the Estimated Date of Completion of Redevelopment Projects for the Sherman Street Tax Increment Financing Redevelopment Plan and Project Area (TIF 12) 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Schaefer to approve Ordinances 9348, 9349, 9350, 9351, and 9352 as read. 

Members voting aye on roll call: Randle, Anthony, Ovian, Dintelman, Schaefer, Stiehl, Weygandt, Sullivan, Osthoff, Whitaker, Schneider, Duco, Eros. (11) 

Motion carries. 

UNFINISHED BUSINESS

None

MISCELLANEOUS & NEW BUSINESS 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Schaefer to pay the Motor Fuel Claims in the Amount of 84,666.87. 

Members voting aye on roll call: Anthony, Ovian, Dintelman, Schaefer, Stiehl, Weygandt, Sullivan, Osthoff, Whitaker, Schneider, Duco, Eros, Randle. (11) 

Motion carries. 

EXECUTIVE SESSION 

Alderperson Schneider made a motion second by Alderperson Schaefer to go into executive session to discuss the purchase or lease of property (5 ILCS 120/2(c)(5)), and pending and/or probable/imminent litigation (5 ILCS 120/2(c)(11)) 

All members voted aye. 

Motion carries. 

Executive Session Starts: 8:05pm 

Executive Session Ends: 8:10pm 

Motion to approve a Real Estate Sales Agreement for property located at 1901 Mascoutah Avenue, Belleville, Illinois (Parcel: 08-26.0-401-018) in the amount of $75,000.00. 

Motion to approve a Settlement Agreement with Teschendorf, et al vs. City of Belleville in the amount of $9,418.29. 

Alderperson Eros made a motion second by Alderperson Schaefer to approve Executive Session motions. 

Members voting aye on roll call: Ovian, Dintelman, Schaefer, Stiehl, Weygandt, Sullivan, Osthoff, Whitaker, Schneider, Duco, Eros, Randle, Anthony. (11) 

Motion carries. 

ADJOURNMENT 

Alderperson Whitaker made a motion second by Alderperson Schaefer to adjourn at 8:13p.m. 

All members present voted aye. 

Motion carries. 

https://www.belleville.net/AgendaCenter/ViewFile/Minutes/_12022024-3380